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TOPIC: Re:composition, process, ideas
#47726
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
hm, I very rarely play around more than twice, maybe three times a week, I just don't have the time to do this every day! Unplugged the rig 4 weeks ago as a part of removing distractions before university exams, and I'm going away for two weeks soon, so that makes it almost two full months with no noodling at all. gotta find the time next year!!

great post! inspiring read
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#47732
King Koopa
Posts: 297
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
1h every morning, sometimes i'm late at work due to that when i found something, one hour in the evening, and a lot of time during the we.
it's an habits now

HK
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#47733
King Koopa
Posts: 273
www.soundcloud.ch/opuswerk
www.opuswerk.ch

Kit:
MD MKII UW
Vermona MonoLancet
Vermona Retroverb MKI
uWave XT
MKS70
Strymon El Capistan
NI Maschine
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
great post.
All I can really add is +1, as this is what i've been doing too.
One thing maybe is don't push the inspiration if it doesn't strike. I'm usually far better off doing sound design, and trying to learn features of my instruments when uninspired.
Also copying a track's structure (noting down when the kick goes out, when the drop comes, the bass switches and the pads kick in...) can help yield some great results and help have a guideline in order to get out of the loopitus.
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#47747
Admin
Posts: 2387
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
Opuswerk wrote:

One thing maybe is don't push the inspiration if it doesn't strike.

agreed. i never to try to force anything. there is always something to do in the studio and more often than not for me when i start making some sounds inspiration is not far behind.

i read a quote by a famous author (whose name escapes me at the moment)... something like (in response to a question of inspiration):

something, something, something... "fortunately, inspiration strikes at nine o'clock sharp every morning". build that shit and they will come.

HUman Koala wrote:

1h every morning, sometimes i'm late at work due to that when i found something

i'm late for work every day dude. coffee and elektron (maybe some live and reaktor) and sure enough it's 8.30 next time i look up.

i'm happy some people are getting something from this. the responses have been insightful for me as i tend to take a lot of my methods for granted and i have not spent any time hanging or communicating with other electronic musicians. i'm admittedly a newb on the MD UW but just hanging around here has lit a serious fire to improve my chops on that thing.

looking forward to more!
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#47750
Game & Watch
Posts: 1896
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
Music is something that continues to inspire and amaze me and as a real music lover I try to listen to a very wide variety of styles.

Things I do
-play my acoustic piano a lot, I force myself to teach me a piece every trimester (classical, something jazzy or a nice pop song from the past - currently working on Chopin's Nocturne in Eb and a piano version of Depeche Mode's 'See You').
-on top of the practicing I'll work out some melodies/phrases/harmonies related to those pieces but in totally different concepts and record them to my portable recorder
-when switching on the electronic devices, and while working on sound design, I'll try to fit any recorded/written part into a couple of patterns
-if it works, I'll explore and expand the project during one or two weeks, if the result is ok by then I'll finish it i.e. in my own way and obviously within my capacities and available time (reason why my tracks have never sounded finished/polished), if it hasn't worked within this time frame it'll be nuked
-sometimes I'll fire up the electronic kit, start sounds from scratch and build up a groove around a specific sound or short sequence and if it works expand from there, I especially like the Mono for this: copy pattern, do a few minor/subtile changes like varying a melody by simply adding or removing (a) note(s) and then build into a track in song mode, often this brings inspiration to modify or add more patterns
-with the MD I speciifically like the CTRL-AL machine to modify and save alternate kits/patterns and expand from there.
-the tone/vibe of my tracks will mostly be dictated by the real life experiences I'm going through, I think, although melancholy is quite a dominant factor in my style, but I guess this is just a reflection of my personality/character

As others have stated, don"t be afraid to be inspired by things from the past, it"s what every miumusician has done upto now, there's no need to reinvent the wheel and don't try to fit into specific genre or style, try as much to sound like yourself.

Will add further to the post if someting else crosses my mind.
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#47751
Chain Chomp
Posts: 521
Dubby music & free samples
http://leocavallo.bandcamp.com
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
Really great thread.

For me one of the great advantages of using hardware in the music making process is that it kind of forces you to focus on really listening to what you're doing.
Listening.. your ears... your hearing.
It's not just about one of five senses.
Many think that listening is way more than that.
Being able to listen deeply to all the sounds around you (including music, of course) is a transcendental experience in itself.
For me that's where "inspiration" is hidden.
Being able to get to that spot, that place where I'm really able to listen. It's where I'm able to experience the beauty of sound in itself.

On the other hand, involving my eyes/vision completely changes that experience for me. It seems that vision someway has a more direct connection to the left side of the brain, invoking your rational side.
No need to say that working at a computer is an almost completely vision-centric experience.

Just a stupid test: http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,22535838-5012895,00.html

Am I going OT?

P.S. Suggested reading: http://www.amazon.com/World-Sound-Brahma-Landscape-Consciousness/dp/0892813180
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#47752
Boo
Posts: 162
0
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
I need to check out that Schoenberg book. I'm listening to some of his piano pieces now, they're really interesting.

Does anyone recall from "This is your Brain On Music" the author suggested that if you are involved in anything for 3 hours a day over 5 years, it amounts to putting enough time to be considered an expert in your field.

When I say that I don't have enough time, that's just an excuse. If you really enjoy something you'll make time for it. You'll squeeze 30 minutes of whatever you love whenever you can. I've said "I don't have the time" so many times before but what it comes down to it is what am I doing now? I'm on the Internet. I'm sure most of you reading this can attest that we all spend far too much time on the Internet.

Also, thanks everyone for your input. This is exactly what I wanted when I suggested there's not enough dialogue about making music.

John
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#47753
Hammer Bro
Posts: 678
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
kirlian wrote:


something, something, something... "fortunately, inspiration strikes at nine o'clock sharp every morning". build that shit and they will come.


I heard that the best creative moment for the brain is at 23 o'clock, the worst at 16 o'clock.
I think it's right for me, generally i'm also late at work but it's because i've done too much music the last night ...
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#47754
Admin
Posts: 2387
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
lcvl: that book has been on my shelf for a year! i guess now it's time to read it. thanks for the reminder.

up late, up early. i always feel my best stuff coming after 23 uhr and before 0200.

night is for my right brain and day my left. how i spend my studio time is usually reflected thusly.
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#47756
King Koopa
Posts: 233
Re:composition, process, ideas 15 Years, 4 Months ago
Hi, (warning: long post!)


When it comes to composition and ideas, I find it hard to see a pattern or regularity in my way of working but there definitely is one:

I can wander for many hours through my equipment doing "research" on how specific sounds are generated. I can try to build strange bassdrums on the md, create patches on the Virus ti and reverse engineer existing patches to see how they were made. I learn a lot of it and one thing that has been very helpful is simply sampling one bar of an existing piece of music and loop it inside the md with the aim of coming as close as you can get. It's funny to see how much variations it generates by just trying to replicate what others have made. Also this forum, the md tips from tarekith and the mnm tips of tib are great sources...although I have made some contributions to them myself, all I can say is: Thanks! It really helps understanding your equipment better and it boosts creativity and experimentation.

What others create is every now and then also a severe source of frustration as it all looks (and sometimes is) so simple. Especially techouse...just listen to some tune on beatport, proton radio or di.fm and many times you hear simple loops, made up of simple components. It frustrates me that with all the technical knowledge I have, it doesn't pop out of my machine on a day by day basis. Record labels like pokerflat for example are bad for my ego as they have some sense of melodic minimalism and simplicity which proves to be very hard to replicate.

The other extreme off course exists as well: For example the German label Perlon records comes up with very minimalistic and abstract productions which are so far above what I can imagine....doing so much with so little....

Creating the movement, the development in a tune, keeping the listener interested and triggering emotions...that's the hard part for me.

However, for me creating music is not about replication or being a look-a-like but simply having fun, learning, being in control and create something that I like, finnished or not, recognised or not. In the end I am not a full blown artist and my life (fortunately) doesn't depend on this. I' m simply an engineer...a computer/maths expert...not someone with a creative aura who has sparkles of creativity around his head but at least someone who understands what he is doing, if needed all the way up to the level of Fourier analysis.

But every now and then, creativity strikes and then, things suddenly move at lightning speed. Once a melody pops into my head, complete with rhythm, bass, chords, etc. I experience just 30 minutes in which every knob I touch turns into gold. A good bassline is programmed in just one minute on the mnm while I previously had been wandering through all kinds of arps and bass patches without any result. Rhythm programming on the md goes fast and sounds really good with every machine I introduce...It fits the bass, the cowbell fits, the hihats...eq-ing to fit it in...filtering to correct...rate reducing to destroy....it all comes together...

So the bottom line is that if I have something to work to...something that lives in my not too creative mind, things go fast and then the experience and the knowledge boost the speed. All the other acitivities are there for learning, fun and research.


There is however one thing which has improved my understanding of producing with the Elektrons. It is a purely technical issue, but I think it is worth to point out here as it helped me in overcoming some producing and arranging problems. The approach is technical and systematic:

In some way, music can be considered a rhythmic repetition of sounds. The repetition aspect can, however not be exaggerated. Just imagine creating a one bar loop and let it run for 4 minutes...that becomes boring after one minute already. Conclusion: music needs a development, a change....while at the same time some elements like rhythm and/or bass must stay the same to keep the song cohesive. So creating music is balancing on the tiny line between change and constants.

This brings up the question how many "change" the Elektrons allow for. The first answer is off course: plenty, just use the parameter locks! But let's look a little closer to that and perform some simple calculations:

The mk1 units have 8 banks of 16 patterns each so that is 128 patterns. There is also memory for 64 kits. So on average, one kit drives two patterns. Simply sticking to this rule means you never run out of kits, although theoretically you could run all 128 patterns on just one kit.

A kit stores the chosen machines and their "default" settings. The pattern, however, stores the triggering of notes (including swing and accent) and off course the parameter locks and glide settings.

So the pattern (triggering of notes and the lock system) is what allows you to create change and variety while the kit forms the basis.

Now let's assume that we want to create a song in which no bar sounds exactly the same, that is: every bar of the song is unique in terms of triggers and locks. Then, how long can a song be?

Let's see:

A pattern has at most two bars on the mk1 units, so one pattern is 8 beats.

As we have 128 patterns inside the Elektrons this means we have:

128 x 8 = 1024 beats.

Assumed that you create music at roughly 128 bpm, this means that you can create at most:

1024/128 = 8 minutes!


So if you use the mk1 units to their full potential, you can create at maximum only 8 minutes of continuously changing (every bar unique) music. On the mkII units, Elektron has doubled the pattern length which brings it to 16 minutes, but it is still not much.


Now, my reason for pointing this out is that if you are creating a full song, everything that poses a unique part of your song costs relatively a lot of pattern memory. So if you want to create a full song on the Elektrons, you will probably end up with at least half or more of the pattern memory used.

It is therefore not strange if the intro or roughly the first two minutes of a song already eat two full pattern banks alone.


Off course I know that not everything in a song is unique. Things are repeated every now and then and existing patterns are reusable.

But if you run into troubles because you are reusing a pattern in songmode (with a different mute configuration for example) and your song is sounding dull, boring and too linear then just ask yourself the question whether that pattern should have a unique element which makes it different from the others. If it does, then you are not struggling with your creativity but you bumped against the constraints of information theory. You are trying to compress (information wise) what cannot be compressed as it is unique. Therefore: copy the pattern and create another one with the needed changes to break out of the boringness...be greedy in using patterns, given the calculations made above.


There are also a few other "tactics" that can be used to break out of the 8 minutes unique issue:

-live tweaking: many people do it and (audio)record straight into a daw or sampler.

-use random lfo's as every time the pattern plays, the affected parameter will sound a little different. (It is not a coincidence that the more randomness or entropy you find in a signal, the harder it gets to compress. True random sequences therefore cannot be compressed.) The lfo's would gain a lot more power if they could affect the trigger timing as well. For example: putting a square wave lfo with depth 4 on a trigger would trigger the note 4 steps before or after the step it was programmed on. (this is probably impossible to implement as it would allow triggering outside the current pattern.)

-copy a track living on track x to track x+1 and program the needed variation by editing the triggers and/or locks. In song mode you selectively (un)mute the appropriate tracks thus creating a variation while it does not cost you an extra pattern. Off course this cannot be used if all 16 or 6 tracks are used.

-(ab?)use songmode by playing only a part of a pattern and mangling it internally. Very powerful and creates unexpected results.

-Put 2 variants of 1 bar drumrolls in one pattern. (you can stash 4 in one pattern in the mkII units) and use songmode to play the appropriate part.


If you made it this far: thanks for reading. This is just an attempt at putting a couple of things in a perspective. Perhaps it helps you in understanding and possibly overcoming loopalitus. Anyway, I still have a long way to go... but it will be fun for sure


M.
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